8PSK Conversion Update

[bluegras]

when is the drop dead date when the final conversion will happen we would like to see some additional hd channels being added.

 

[Troch77]

I'm betting the percentage of international customers doing what I mentioned is greater than the 1% mentioned. I have seen and heard of a lot of people that have a 1000+ dish, and stick with 110/119/129/118.7. It's easier in cases as well, not to mention LOS issues. Remember, that is one thing Dish has over most providers, is their very large international availability(plus their online streaming option for the internationals, DishWorld). Either way, those customers can do a mixed arc, or settled with a much easier single arc solution. They have options, and with options come possibilities. I'd suspect a greater number of WA customers, over EA customers. There are also customers in EA locations with SD receivers and a Dish500. If you read their Dish Forum, or their Facebook page, you see quite a few of them.

What you hear and what actually happens are 2 different things.

When I wanted Euronews, A local Tech came out to Verify my LOS for the 118, and the EA2 needed to be swapped for the 1000.4 or My Dpp44 could be used and a Dish 500 Plus for a wing was needed for the 118.
And I said no way.

 

[Hall]

I can't believe there are any 2700/2800/3700/3900/4700/4900 still out there, those receivers date back to the 90's

I know they're not as old as the receivers you listed, but my parents own some apartments and some tenants moved out and left (2) Dish 301 receivers. Those were first released, I believe, around 2002. Were the tenants using them up until they moved out ? No idea....

 

[ChadT41]

What you hear and what actually happens are 2 different things.

When I wanted Euronews, A local Tech came out to Verify my LOS for the 118, and the EA2 needed to be swapped for the 1000.4 or My Dpp44 could be used and a Dish 500 Plus for a wing was needed for the 118.
And I said no way.

But in my post I accounted for setups similar to what you describe based on LOS, and although not mentioned it should be evident as well, the supplies techs have available to make situations work. Even if 25% of international customers in EA markets stick with a dish500+, the WA would still have a stronger presence. You have your half of the country with WA(in theory) and the 25% of international customers sticking with the WA setup(also a lot of these customers have been with dish and the same setup since pre2009 which is when EA and MPEG4 on EA was instituted.

 

[DishSubLA]

So basically DISH will only support VIP or Hopper receivers now. That should really clean up a lot of time , having to support the old software for all those receivers going back to 96 and 97.

Actually, 311 and 322 are still supported and are 8PSK, and those boxes are not ViP.

 

[navychop]

when is the drop dead date when the final conversion will happen we would like to see some additional hd channels being added.

The twelfth of Jupiter.

 

[ChadT41]

Actually, 311 and 322 are still supported and are 8PSK, and those boxes are not ViP.

512 and 522 and 625 as well. I think they finally axed the 381(my favorite SD receiver) as non QPSK. Was genius technology for its time, and a beautiful feature I wish would return in the future... Inputs.

 

[navychop]

Feverish, I think you are! INPUTS!

BWUHAHAHA!

 

[ChadT41]

Lol, come on.... If done correctly, how much do you think they would limit phone calls for "You peices of crap suck so bad! I was watching TV and now I just have snow!!! I am cancelling and you will waive the ETF". God I, and likely any CS or tech out there, has heard this so many times, they would rather just put the damn inputs in the box and save time money and sanity.

 

[jegrant]

I had a 3900 (software upgraded to 4900) until Dish sent me a 311 to replace it just recently. It was on my bedroom TV which still hasn't been upgraded to HD. I still wish they would have sent me a 211 instead so I could have had MPEG-4 & HD.

 

[pattykay]

I know they're not as old as the receivers you listed, but my parents own some apartments and some tenants moved out and left (2) Dish 301 receivers. Those were first released, I believe, around 2002. Were the tenants using them up until they moved out ? No idea....

They are older than that. I bought two 301's before I bought my 501 back in 2001.

 

[dishrich]

A related question for WA subs...has anyone noticed that at least some of the SD channels look a little better than before???
I'm asking this because even though I have HD, there's obviously SD-only channels that I do watch from time to time (namely the superstations) & I swear they don't look as bad as they did before.
(NOT that I'm suggesting they look GOOD; just saying maybe this 8PSK conversion had an SD picture quality benefit... )

 

[DishSubLA]

A related question for WA subs...has anyone noticed that at least some of the SD channels look a little better than before???
I'm asking this because even though I have HD, there's obviously SD-only channels that I do watch from time to time (namely the superstations) & I swear they don't look as bad as they did before.
(NOT that I'm suggesting they look GOOD; just saying maybe this 8PSK conversion had an SD picture quality benefit... )

I have observed, for a short period, a FEW SD's that look a bit improved, and as of late, I now see some SD's WORSE than QPSK days.

Further, there are some HD channels that also look WORSE. It looks to me like even with the 8PSK benefits, Dish is DEGRADING PQ even MORE. I especially notice what I would call a lack of luminescence data, or dark shadows appearing as reflective purple instead of black and dark areas suffering from obvious large pixels and also moderate to sever banding. NONE of these poor attributes of PQ--and I mean on the HD channels--were obviously noticeable when Dish was using QPSK for the SD's.

This brings the obvious question: considering the bandwidth savings of all SD channels now at 8PSK, and given the DEGRADATION of PQ for the HD channels, why is Dish crushing the data and resulting in inferior PQ? What will this new available bandwidth be used for, since it SHOULD have resulted in noticeably better PQ for ALL channels? Well, Dish does have to add at least one 4K channel/service. Dish may bring RSN's to 24/7 HD. And who knows what else Dish needs to make room for, including back-up resources.

So, the irony is, at least as of today, the full 8PSK change-over has resulted, to my eye, over all INFERIOR PQ for almost ALL channels on the WA (to be fair, I should note that ONE DAY an HD channel looks pretty bad, but then find the NEXT DAY it is looking far better: evidence of tweaking at Dish, so it is still experimental to some degree). Can this be eating up, and possibly even overtaxing the additional bandwidth gained. Dish could be testing/tweaking encoding very aggressively, including the HD channels, to see how much bandwidth they can squeeze for future use while still having the PQ of current channels acceptable. But acceptable is NOT! We expect better than that for HD and even the SD channels. So, while adding services/channels would have been impossible with SD's at QPSK, the move to 8PSK for the SD's provides the bandwidth to add future services, but only at the cost of some degree of degrading PQ for many channels that previously had good PQ, including many HD channels. I certainly hope that is not the case.

I had been meaning to post my observations of how the HD PQ is worse on several HD and SD channels compared to before the full 8PSK implementation. Let's hope Dish is still tweaking and will bring the PQ to at least what it was before while still having the benefits of increased bandwidth.

 

[zippyfrog]

I have observed, for a short period, a FEW SD's that look a bit improved, and as of late, I now see some SD's WORSE than QPSK days.

That is a good post! I had my receiver go out, and the day I was waiting for the new replacement receiver to arrive, I was watching ESPN via my Chromecast through the Watch ESPN app. When you watch the compressed version everyday, you forget how much the channel is compressed until you see a clearer and crisper version. You wonder how much more Dish can compress...

In terms of channels - I watch almost exclusively HD channels. There are only a couple of channels I watch in SD from time to time and only 1 I watch consistently in SD - CSN Chicago. I was watching Sportstalk Live last week and I remember very clearly seeing the edge of the CSN Blue Ticker being more pixilated and "bleeding" at the edges into the programs. Overall the whole picture was more pixilated and the picture looked more "soft" than normal. Watching it yesterday though, I felt like it was more like what I was used to seeing - not great picture, but it looks like SD and watchable. So I do agree with you in your evidence that Dish is doing some tweaking. Just wish CSN Chicago was in HD 24/7!

 

[gadgtfreek]

To me, some channels look very good (HD), others not so much. FX usually isnt so hot depending on the show, but I saw that on Directv. AMC is hit or miss but they film Walk Dead to look like a 70's movie.

I do see in dark scenes (The Strain) a lot of crawling around in the dark areas. Compression all the way but not sure if it is Dish's fault or Fox's. My OTA channels beat my lil's EASILY. Premium channels can look good, but still dark scenes in GoT's for example on HBO is problematic. Once again, compression.

 

[Juan]

To me, some channels look very good (HD), others not so much. FX usually isnt so hot depending on the show, but I saw that on Directv. AMC is hit or miss but they film Walk Dead to look like a 70's movie.

I do see in dark scenes (The Strain) a lot of crawling around in the dark areas. Compression all the way but not sure if it is Dish's fault or Fox's. My OTA channels beat my lil's EASILY. Premium channels can look good, but still dark scenes in GoT's for example on HBO is problematic. Once again, compression.

Are your locals Mpeg4 or mpeg2?

 

[gadgtfreek]

You got me!

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